Submission details
Dialog windows lack keyboard shortcuts and tabbing (by default)
By default, tabbing through buttons in a dialog window is off, which makes it ever so bothersome to quickly deal with them. Furthermore there is no proper indication of hotkeys, like you have in Windows (underlining the letter).
For instance, can anyone tell me which key to press for "Sleep"? (It's a rhetorical question, I know it's S)
Medium
Low
Not fixed
Discussion (21 comments)
Just because it's Mac doesn't mean it shouldn't adopt usability standards :P
Right, I know you can turn it on, and my point was that it should be on by default. There is no reason not to have it on by default, other than it might not be as 'perfect' to look at.
And as Long says, just because it's in Windows and WORKS well, doesn't mean it shouldn't be adopted. I'm sure the braniacs at Apple can come up with something.
i prefer the current design. it forces me to be more careful--by taking more effort--about what i'm doing. it's a good security feature.
As a "switcher" from a Linux/Windows environment, I miss hitting "y" or "n" A LOT. It's funny because it's such a small thing, but one of my biggest grips with OS X... This and cutting/pasting files, but that's another entry. ;-)
On dialogs usually you can use Command+D for Don't Save
Command + C or Esc for Cancel
etc...
Just hitting D usually works, and I've found that in MOST apps they do manage to map in the first letter of the option as a shortcut, but it's never actually indicated.
As for the 'security feature' of this, that's like arguing that Apple should continue making one-buttoned mice so people don't accidentally press the wrong one and do something bad in the context menu.
If you're used to using the keyboard mainly, it's stupid that you have to move your hand over to the mouse to perform an action that's usually way faster to do with the keyboard. If you don't feel like you can handle the pressure of maybe tabbing to the wrong one, you can use the mouse :-P
*sigh*
enter selects safe option, space unsafe option, esc cancels.
That specific dialog is broken, blame Adobe for that.
http://i38.tinypic.com/mhvt3.png
http://i36.tinypic.com/i52ic0.png
On most good apps, holding down the Command key will reveal keyboard commands for the buttons.
http://www.ccsgraphic.com/Extras/dialog-commands.png
Oh, and John, let's not forget the classic Command+. (period) for Cancel. :-)
You *can* enable tabbing between options in dialog boxes in Leopard. Go to System Preferences > Keyboard and Mouse. At the bottom of the screen set: "In windows and dialogs, press Tab to move the keyboard focus between:" to "All controls".
See:
http://www.grabup.com/uploads/9e0b24c9e15f8f6169034fa3fdc3967f.png
@ John Lambo: You nailed it. Looks like a problem with Photoshop
Changed title from [Dialog windows lack keyboard shortcuts and tabbing] to [Dialog windows lack keyboard shortcuts and tabbing (by default)].
Changed problem description.
It's my understanding, as well, that this is an Adobe issue, not an OS X issue. Also, Adobe apps don't exactly follow any guidelines when comes to Windows or OS X.
@ ccsccs7: Thanks for the tip. TextWrangler is a "good app," but interestingly TextEdit isn't!
Changed problem description.
Changed severity from [Low] to [Medium].
Added new image attachment.
It's not an Adobe Issue - the previous screenshot i had was just maybe a stupid example so I've replaced it.
This is ridiculous. If you don't like the way it is by default, and there's an option to change it, then just change it. Not everyone is going to agree on the best way to do things, which is exactly why there are options for changing the way things work. Whichever one is default really doesn't matter - I'd imagine the current default is set because it used to be ONLY like that before they added the option, and they didn't want people having to look through system preferences to find the place to change it BACK to the way it always was before.
I think shortcuts could appear when pressing cmd for 2 seconds, like in TextWrangler/BBEdit. Otherwise I'm against it, as it adds too much "visual noise and distraction".
Usability Standards, yes!
This non-tabbing and keyboard-shortcut-lacking issue is rampant among apps, even when the feature is enabled. Sadly, ADOBE is a major culprit ... especially with Dreamweaver. The new versions have not fixed this, but I don't think it should be an application-specific thing.
THIS REALLY MAKES ME WANT TO TEAR UP LITTLE TEDDY BEARS!!
CS4 for Mac is coming up. Adobe suspended the release for some reason, I think it has something to do with snow leopard not having Carbon and using 100% cocoa> Anyway, finder is going to be cocoa too! and so is CS4!! hopefully this means no more not-windows, not-mac, not-java-ish dialog boxes!
On a Dialog windows, I would also like to change selection with the left/right arrow keys.
I think you can tab through with the 'tab' button.
How about CONSISTENCY? The fact that there isn't a really well specified standard means that each apps does it it's own stupid way. At least on Windows it's almost always consistent between apps whereas on Mac it's almost never consistent between apps.
So which O/S is more usable now?!?
wctaiwan wrote on August 10, 2008, 2:36pm
"like you have in Windows" - Yeah, this is Mac OS though.
While the hotkey bit is indeed a major unchangeable difference between Windows and Mac OS, the tabbing-through-controls can be enabled in System Preferences -> Keyboard and Mouse -> Keyboard Shortcuts.